Episode 63: Kids (PRO 2×16-20)
Rob: Welcome back to Subspace Radio.
It is me, Rob, and joining
me as always is Kevin.
How are you?
Kevin: I'm great.
Rob: Wonderful to hear your voice as well.
We have officially hit the halfway point
of season two of Star Trek Prodigy.
We're going to look at five episodes
in the second half, the back
end of, um, Season 2 of Prodigy.
Netflix have done their usual
thing, they have dumped an
entire season on Netflix, but we,
Kevin: We're here to pick
up the pieces of that dump.
Rob: We are here to pick it up.
And we are the connoisseurs of
Star Trek, and we are not going
to devour it all in 20 episodes.
Kevin: No, we'll pick
through it, meticulously.
Rob: Right, because
Kevin: any rush whatsoever.
Rob: Exactly.
Slow and steady wins the race,
Kevin: We'll savor it.
We savor this pile of Star Trek.
Rob: Exactly, so we're gonna go
through 11, 12, 13, 14, and 15.
Oh, and, oh yeah, spoilers, 15
is, uh, the start of a two parter.
So, damn you, algorithm.
Kevin: Uh yeah, our crew has reunited
with Chakotay, who's a bit of a
broken captain, and that's our theme
for this week is broken captains,
or captains broken by tragedy.
So we'll be talking about that after,
after we run through these 5 episodes.
Rob: And as always, it wouldn't be
a Star Trek Prodigy, uh, exploration
episode by Subspace Radio if we didn't
have an introductory breakdown of
said five episodes by Kevin Yank.
So, DJ, spin that wheel.
Kevin: Alright, um Episode 11, Last
Flight of the Protostar, Part I.
The team meets a marooned Captain
Chakotay, who's lived for ten years
on the dead hulk of the Protostar.
His first officer Adreek having died in
search of antimatter to refuel the ship.
Before they can fix the ship,
they must first fix its captain.
Dal gets lost in a storm and stumbles
upon Adreek's body and the antimatter
he managed to collect before he died.
In Last Flight of the Protostar, Part II,
the crew retrofits the Protostar to sail
across the ocean of vapor in search of
deuterium to power the ship's engines.
Chakotay teaches Dal to look
past his bruised ego and to
go where he's needed most.
With the ship circling the eye of
the storm, Dal saves Chakotay's
life, when he falls overboard.
They use the last of the ship's reserves
to collect the fuel they need to escape.
Meanwhile, Admiral Janeway makes
a call to Wesley Crusher's mom.
In a Tribble called Quest, Zero gets
slightly crushed on a desolate world
that promises to be a source of bosonite
to power up the Protostar's proto core.
The planet is overrun with
genetically modified Tribbles
thanks to a Klingon scientist.
Rok-Tahk helps Dr.
Kruvang to engineer a virus
to solve the Tribble problem.
The crew gets its bosonite and they
adopt Bribble, a mutant Tribble with
a face, and legs, if I'm not mistaken.
Rob: That's right.
Kevin: In Cracked Mirror, the crew of
the restored Protostar reunites with
Voyager A, only to find that they have
slipped into an alternate reality.
As they work with the Doctor to unravel
this puzzle, the team makes the rookie
mistake of splitting the party, and
soon discovers that different decks
exist in different alternate realities.
Rob: That sounds familiar.
Kevin: Yes, it does sound familiar.
They visit Captain Tuvix's Voyager,
hunt for souvenirs with Okona in a
trashed mess hall, and finally end
up in the Mirror Universe, where they
manage to convince Mirror Janeway and
Chakotay to help them return home.
Chakotay and Janeway are
reunited in the transporter room.
And then, in Ascension Part
I, Dal joins the Nova Squadron
cadets in their training.
The Doctor and Jankom Pog start
work on a new body for Zero.
Janeway tempts fate with the statement,
I'm looking forward to what comes next.
Jelico orders the two ships back to Earth.
A call from Gwyn's father on
Solum warns of Asencia using time
manipulation technology to build
warships, one of which arrives to
attack Voyager and the Protostar.
Despite heroic maneuvers,
both ships are disabled.
Asencia watches on with her
prisoner, Wesley Crusher.
Rob: Dun, dun.
Kevin: Dun, dun, dun.
Should have seen it coming, but I didn't.
Rob: Neither did I!
Kevin: Where could they have gotten
such time bending technology?
Rob: So yeah, there's a lot to unpack.
There's a lot they went
through in just five episodes.
The two-parter opener in particular, Last
Flight of the Protostar, they went through
so much in just two 20 minute episodes.
Kevin: There was a lot of passage of time
in that as well, so it felt like there
was that one shot of, like, the Protostar
lying there with days passing and rapid
flicking through, uh, through the sun
going overhead, and it was amazing.
Rob: Definitely, definitely.
Um, first thing off the bat, we did
talk about it in previous episodes,
um, I was a little bit cautious about
how, Chakotay would be voiced, but um,
Kevin: Yes?
Yes?
Verdict?
Rob: I was, I was quite happy.
I was suitably impressed.
It's not, he's not, you know, up
there, um, with Kate Mulgrew or, or
Kevin: No, not gonna win any awards, but
he acquitted himself admirably, I thought.
Rob: I wasn't disappointed
and I wasn't embarrassed.
Kevin: I think this is the most
likable Chakotay has been ever.
Rob: I was about to say that,
yeah, yeah, that is exactly right.
I'm there going, I like this Chakotay.
This Chakotay is good.
This is like, you know, I like cranky,
emotionally damaged Chakotay, who
has to, you know, and I love the fact
that they've set up these kids as
going, These kids can help anyone.
They're very much like the
nerds in, um, uh, Galaxy Quest,
like Justin Long all those
Kevin: Their enthusiasm will
carry anyone through anything.
Rob: Exactly!
They just go, we're not gonna fight
ya, we're gonna love ya to death,
and you're gonna love us back.
Kevin: I have to say, possibly the
highlight of this block of episodes
was a really subtle thing, but I can't
believe I didn't realize we'd be getting
it, is, uh, re meeting Hologram Janeway,
before she knew knows her crew and the
fact that we know that character really
as someone who died who sacrificed
themselves, those opening scenes where
Chakotay is like at the bottom of the
ramp of the Protostar and she's up inside
which is only as far it's as close as
she can get with her holo-emitters,
but she's over his shoulder, this
teeny little, uh, presence in the
distance who's like shrugging silently
and it reads like her ghost to me.
Like she had this ghostly presence
in this, these opening scenes
that was just haunting and I
thought it was so effective.
Both times it choked me
up just seeing her there.
Rob: Definitely, definitely.
And it did seem like, yeah, the, and
for Chakotay it was the, the spirit of,
you know, Janeway haunting him as well.
Because he had a lot of haunting going on,
so much time passing, like, representing
Kevin: Ten years of missing her but being,
having her presence there the whole time.
Rob: So, the, do you think they've leaned
into… I think they have, they've leaned,
like, it was, what we've talked about
before when it comes to Voyager, the, you
know, is there something there between
the two of them, and there's like one
episode we reviewed with Janeway going,
was there ever anything between us?
And he goes, purely
professional, and she goes, Oh.
Like, almost a could been, and
then out of the blue in season
seven, oh, okay, Chakotay's with
Seven of Nine now, Okay, bye.
But it does seem to be this sense of,
it is a professional, but there is a
professional relationship, but there's
definitely something under there
that they are not shying away from.
Kevin: It's more than friendship and
I too am getting, they're definitely
walking that line and I feel like
they're walking it deliberately.
Having him be nervous and dressing
up to meet her and, and like the,
the hologram saying, is it so
bad that it looks like you tried?
The, the moment when they, they hug in
the transporter room, there is a sense
they are both, like, feeling emotions
they're not entirely acknowledging
or communicating or saying out loud.
I think it is all there for the
fans to see if they want to, um,
but there's nothing here that
tells me they've crossed the line.
It reminds me, you know, if it was
Spock and Kirk, and Spock was not
an emotionless Vulcan, and they were
heterosexuals of the opposite sex,
would it have been just as charged
when Spock and Kirk reunited in Star
Trek III, at the end of Star Trek III?
I feel like it might have been.
Like, that, that friendship that is deeper
than words that comes from a captain
and their first officer, I think that
is at least what they're going for, and
the fact that they are, you know, warm
blooded man and woman who, who, uh, have,
eyes for the opposite sex, it seems like
there would be a natural connection there
that is at least bordering on romantic.
Rob: Mm, yeah.
Kevin: Even if they feel like they
could never go there, they would
both still be feeling the feelings.
Rob: And can I just say, you know,
we've talked a lot about, when it comes
to Prodigy, about how impressive the
animation is when it comes to, landscapes
and, uh, spacescapes and all that type of
stuff, and we've had little conversations
here or there about how the animation of
the humanoids or the facial expressions
aren't the most expressive or, but to
get all that subtext to get all that
detail for what they're working with,
that's an incredibly impressive amount
of work with the animation that they
have and what they're doing, so my hat's
Kevin: I said earlier in this season
that I could see Kate Mulgrew through
the animation of the close ups.
Think the same is true of Robert Beltran.
Like, I forget we are not watching
human Robert Beltran at parts here.
Um, yeah, it was amazing.
And watching his mirror, both of their
mirror opposites was, like, I feel
like that was just as, uh, delicious as
watching the Intendant on Deep Space Nine.
I don't, I don't feel like we missed
out on the live action version of that.
I feel like we got to see
exactly what it would be through
the quality of this animation.
Rob: Agreed.
No, it's definitely, um, uh, they're
working within their, I hate to say
limitations, but with their, with
the facial expressions and stuff like
that, they're not, they don't have
a budget like, you know, a Pixar.
Kevin: They're putting the money where
it matters, cause the body, like the,
the walking animations and running
animations, the, the figure animations
are still to my eye, stilted and, and,
uh, stiff, but the facial animations
that really sell that there is a
character there, they are spending
the extra time on making that work.
And I wouldn't have the opposite, you
know, given, given they are working within
constraints, I feel like they're doing
a great job of putting the attention
to detail where it matters most.
Rob: Agreed.
Totally agree.
Yeah.
Yeah, these first two episodes are great.
Really good.
And it doesn't, like, the time passing
doesn't seem like they're rushing.
Doesn't seem like there's chunks left out.
It seems like a, like a really
compact, efficient way of
telling, telling the story.
Kevin: A Tribble called
Quest lost me a little.
That one, not my favorite.
And there's not a whole lot
there on rewatch, I feel like.
Rob: It's very, it's very kid
orientated, uh, there to get
us to the point where they have
their new Tribble Rok-Tahk blend?
Kevin: Uh, yeah, I guess so.
It hadn't occurred to me
that it was part Rok-Tahk.
I just thought it was a, a
mutated Tribble, but uh, yeah.
They don't really go into detail.
is a, a tainted specimen.
Rob: It was good to see, and this
was a potential topic, uh, mentioned
by you, to see a Klingon scientist.
Um, particularly the, the episode
we, I reviewed, um, couple, way a few
episodes ago from Enterprise where
they had the, um, the Klingon in prison
with Archer and talking what Klingon
culture used to be before this bloodlust
took over and this We were cultured.
We were, you know, explorers.
We were, you know, scientists type stuff.
Um, it was good to see a
little taste of that here.
Kevin: It was funny when Chakotay
said, Klingon scientists, you don't
see many of those nowadays, ha ha ha.
Wow, casual racism alive and
well in the 24th century.
Rob: It's still, it's still
there, thanks Chakotay.
Kevin: I'm surprised that scientist
didn't go, I'm gonna rip your throat out!
A fun character, I thought, that Klingon
and that they had to, you know, take
his phaser away when push came to shove,
Rob: Yeah,
Kevin: was kind of fun.
But yeah, this was kind
of a hollow episode to me.
Um, Cracked Mirror, much richer,
I think, because of that Mirror
Universe, um, Chakotay Janeway stuff.
Um, I don't know.
Okona, nice to see him back.
Don't think he did much.
Rob: No.
And it was a case of, like with the
Borg episode in Season 1, this was
very much a, you know, an introduction
into what the Mirrorverse is,
Kevin: realities, oh, and the
Mirror Universe specifically.
Rob: Specifically that, so we
weren't dealing with, overly
sexualized interpretations,
Kevin: Yeah, it was the kid friendly
version of the Mirror Universe again,
Rob: Yeah, no graphic violence
from, thank you Discovery.
It was, um, it was very much a case
of Chakotay could kind of get away
by putting grease on as his goatee.
Kevin: then Murf did the same,
Uh, silly Murf almost gave the game away.
Rob: Ha ha
Kevin: Uh, I noticed that, uh, I don't
know if it's a Mirror Universe thing,
but, uh, or if it's a Robert Beltran
thing, but Mirror Chakotay did not know
Come out, come out wherever you are
as, as like a rhyme with that cadence.
He said, Come out!
Come out!
Wherever you are!
Like someone told him, sing it!
It's like a song!
And he was not familiar with that song.
Rob: What's it, it's from a horror
movie as well, or a, actually,
Kevin: out, come out, wherever you are.
I'm sure Captain Picard
has sung it at least once.
Rob: I mean, but, uh, it's ingrained
in my childhood of knowing that
so, but yeah, it is repeated, this
type of format of it's a different
dimension, uh, On every different level.
It's like a Voyager episode we've reviewed
Kevin: Chakotay even says, I've been
through something just like this.
I won't go so far as to mention the
episode title, but my ship also is
split up into multiple realities.
It seems to be a Voyager
thing, apparently.
Have that happen to them.
Rob: I did like the re I do like how
they title the uh, Mirror episode.
Kevin: Oh yeah, as soon as I saw it in
the list, I was like, we're going to the
mirror universe, Cracked Mirror, very
Rob: yep.
yep.
Related to, I'm assuming there's
a bit of connection there to
the Agatha Christie novel.
So, we take that.
Kevin: I really love the cracked screen
in the trashed mess hall of, of the, the
Starfleet that had suffered devastation
from the virus on board the Protostar.
And they were like hanging out at
the mess hall and it was just like,
someone's head had obviously gone
into that big screen in the mess
hall was just shattered from a point.
But not only were like parts of the
display showing like different colors
like you'd get from a broken liquid
crystal display, but parts of it were
also showing graphics at the wrong scaling
level so there were some like extra large
numbers and stuff, and I just that's the
second time this season that Starfleet
technology has glitched in an interesting
way that I appreciated, uh, so yeah, um,
there's obviously some, some computer
nerds on the team somewhere there at
Prodigy who are thinking a little, a
little more about, okay, it's broken.
How would it break?
Rob: Yes.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Uh, shout out to the mention of Tuvix.
We didn't see Tuvix.
So justice,
Kevin: Captain Tuvix, if you will!
Rob: Captain Tuvix.
Hashtag justice for Captain Tuvix.
Kevin: Yeah, exactly.
And apparently with at least one
officer on board from that, uh, that
race of All the World's a Stage, that
was the, the people mocking Starfleet.
Rob: Right.
I did see them pass by and went
that, uh, is, are they all on here?
But no, it was uh, one of them there.
So
Kevin: And then we had Ascension part
one with a big, another big spiky ship
coming out of, you know, a plane in space.
It seems to be a recurring thing.
It's just very, very reminiscent
of the Shrike and Nero's
ship in Star Trek, uh, 2009.
Rob: That's right.
Yeah.
I saw that and I went,
this looks familiar.
Um, this, this was intense, and this
was very much the first part of of a
two part, uh, storyline where they were
put in the worst situation imaginable.
Kind of like, um, in Picard Season 3,
where it's like, Jonathan Frake said
the famous lines, fire everything, and
they all pretty much destroyed the ship.
Kevin: Yeah, it, it is a little awkward
that we're talking about only part
one of a two parter here, but it does
feel like that was intended as a Best
of Both Worlds-style cliffhanger.
We're meant to be waiting for
what happens next week at this
point, at least in the writing.
And, also this episode was very much
structured like one earlier in the
season where I feel like, the first
two thirds of this episode was kind
of collecting ourselves and catching
our breath and debriefing from what
had happened to this point and talking
about what, what would happen next.
And just that, that standoff in space
with Asencia's ship really was kind
of just a button on the episode.
It was a good 10 minute button,
but it was more of a coda than the
bulk of, or the body of this story.
Rob: Yeah, definitely there's, um,
taking that time to breathe to, you
know, reconnect Chakotay and Janeway
and have the, the Prodigy cast
sort of like do their debrief and
reconnect and see how everything is.
Ooh, I forgot to mention, oh yeah,
Mirror Universe Evil Whale as well.
Kevin: Yes, of course, even the whales are
Rob: Even the whales.
I love that line.
Yep.
Um,
Kevin: In Ascension, uh, when, when I
really appreciate it, I'm, I'm, I'm part
of a very narrow target demographic for
the scene, where, uh, Janeway and Chakotay
are bonding over comm badge designs.
That was, uh, Right up my alley.
I think I mentioned previously that
those gold comm badges were specifically
introduced in Endgame, and they have that
conversation on screen in this episode,
Rob: I did, I did think of you going
somewhere right now, Kevin Yank
Kevin: I'm squeeing!
Rob: Ha ha ha, or doing the meme of,
uh, Leonardo DiCaprio from Once Upon a
Time in, uh, Hollywood, doing the, Yeah.
Kevin: Pointing at the
screen violently, yes.
Zero's story of getting a new body,
I thought it took, uh, a slight turn
here, a very subtle one, but it's
starting to bring me around, is Zero
saying the line, More than anything,
Doctor, I just want to feel like me.
And I feel like I at least have criticized
earlier in the season Zero's story being
a bit homo-sapiens-first as, uh, yeah,
you know, walking, treading that well
trodden soil of an alien species or a
non-human species wanting to be human
and, and therefore, you know, implying
their, their original form is lesser than.
That's one thing for an android
created by human hands in Data.
It's another thing entirely for a
fully evolved, full, full-fledged non
corporeal species like the Medusans.
Rob: And especially with,
um, say a character like Odo.
Odo seemed to be, you know, his
human form and becoming more
human seemed to be a trap for
him, like a cage, an imprisonment.
When he started to fully explore and
find out what his true form was and what
he could achieve, that was a freedom
there, which I really appreciated.
And that's what kind of held me back, you
know, one of my major criticisms of the
most perfect Star Trek series ever is when
you finally meet the, uh, the Founders,
they look, they have the same facial
expressions as, the same face as Odo.
And I'm there going, no, no, no,
people are more, these are more
advanced members of his culture.
They would be to literally transform,
and they do transform into anyone,
it doesn't make sense that they have
the exact same face as him, and they
never really justify it, explain it,
we are taking this form to make you
feel more comfortable, or whatever.
Kevin: This is our, this is our casual
humanoid like, you know, we give you
the gist, but it's not a great effort.
Rob: But yeah, so there was always
that case of Odo never wanted to
really, he had to conform to fit
Kevin: Oh, he went through, I feel like
he went through several interesting
kind of arcs with that as well.
It was like, it was something
he did to fit in, uh, something
he did to please his captors.
Rob: he was punishment, he had to be
Kevin: Yeah, it was something
he was curious about or that he
did because he was in love with
a human or a humanoid in Kira.
And then by the end he discovered
you know, yes that's something I
can do and something I can be but
I can also be many other things.
And that, that wholeness of my being
is who I am, and, and the person I
love has to be on board for that and
she is and that's the, that's the
delight and the tragedy the ending.
Rob: Yeah, and that took seven seasons
of development, which is incredible.
So, um, having, you know, you
know, being halfway through the
second season for Zero, definitely.
Uh, you know, there's so much
potential there for it to be.
I love that line.
Like you said, it's, you know, I
Kevin: Yeah.
So coming back to Zero in
this episode, I feel like.
I don't know if it's entirely there,
but I want to see it there, is there
is a sense that this is, now at least
it is a personal journey for Zero.
It is not something that we assume all
Medusans wish they could be humanoid,
or all non corporeal life wish they
could have senses, physical senses.
But this is something that
Zero is wrestling with in their
identity, and it has a bit of a
trans narrative about it, to me.
I am, I am a corporeal born as
a non corporeal, uh, you know,
and that to me is interesting.
That is something we've not seen before.
Uh, it is, I think probably no
coincidence that it is coming from the
character with non binary pronouns.
This character is the one they have
chosen for these kinds of narratives,
but I'm happy to go there with it.
And I hope through the rest of this
season they have an opportunity
to lean into that further.
I hope, beyond hope, that we get to
see more stories of this character
beyond season two and that we will be
able to explore that further because
that feels like a juicy thing to be
exploring through science fiction in
an honest, genuine, good natured way.
Rob: Yeah, I agree.
I agree.
Kevin: Beverly Crusher feels
like, uh, maybe something worth
taking a moment to acknowledge.
Rob: was, I was wondering if
we'd take a moment for, for Bev.
It's great to have Bev back.
Great to have
Kevin: And to see her at a moment in her
life where we've not seen her before.
I feel like, I guess we're getting
that with, with Janeway and to a lesser
extent Chakotay as well this season.
But, uh, we've seen Crusher before this,
and we've seen Crusher after this, and
seeing this at this moment, where I
guess she has not had her second son yet?
She's still at Starfleet, it seems?
She's helping with the, the
Romulan, uh, evacuation?
Rob: is before the big, uh, disaster.
Kevin: Yeah, before the big disaster,
there's some mention of the androids
that go haywire in Picard, uh, season
one, and, uh, yeah, so it is, she
is on the precipice of basically
leaving it all behind and going off
on her, uh, her unexpected departure.
Uh, and it's really interesting
to see that character here.
I don't feel like we've seen that
look of her as well, the short,
uh, uh, kind of white hair, um,
it was, and yet, the likeness came
through, um, it was, it was lovely.
And just to hear her talking about
Wesley, that's something that has felt
off limits for that character, it's
like, it was so weird, it was so sci
fi woo woo, what happened to her son,
that having her reflect on it felt like
something they could never do justice
to on screen, but they, they, they
walked that line here, and I liked it.
Rob: Yeah, and especially because
we talked about it before, but I'm
there going, they didn't mention him
at all, really, in Picard Season 3.
It's all focused on, let's
focus on the new model.
Um, so to actually have, you know, because
they were pretty much inseparable for
the first couple of seasons, you know.
Where Beverly went, Wesley
was there, you know.
Literally, the first time you see
them as characters, they are together.
Um, and so Yeah, it seemed a bit odd
that they purposely avoided, you know,
obviously, you know, uh, you know, a
female character isn't defined by the fact
that she's a mother or by her, you know,
that her son is there, but, um, uh, it
was good, especially because there was no
mention from Beverly of Wesley in Picard
Season 3 to have her openly talk about,
to find out, and this type of stuff, um,
when she's still with the Federation,
high up, you know, good position for her
before everything goes to crap for her.
Um, it was wonderful, just to have
that, yeah, like you said, that time
sci fi woo woo thing of going, yeah,
he's a temporal agent, um, multi
powerful time lord, um, but, you know,
Kevin: wish he just had
more time for his mother.
Rob: Yeah, ha ha ha ha ha, good line.
Kevin: All right, so, uh, was there
anything else you wanted to pick out
of those episodes for discussion?
Rob: Look, yeah, I'm just, just
overall, it's It's such a good watch.
It's such an easy watch.
It's such a, yeah, um, I don't know what
show, uh, those, I mean, fandom across all
franchises is getting quite toxic and, um,
gets the forefront of attention online and
in the world, um, but this is just such
a, a show that loves it's Star Trek and
loves the essence of what Star Trek is.
It doesn't get caught up
being in it's own backside.
It has its incredible episodes,
its dull episodes, but it's, it's
producing the goods consistently and,
Kevin: Yeah.
It's not perfect, not every episode
is a 10 out of 10, but it is rewarding
to watch, and, um, yeah, it pays
back, uh, love of Star Trek in kind.
Rob: Yeah, so it's, it's, it's, it's
a joy to watch and it's a joy to talk
about it with you, so I'm glad, um,
you we've, we've, we've been doing this
thing so long so we don't just, you
know, it was all started just to talk
about, um, Strange New Worlds and, uh,
it's opened my, uh, perception of Star
Trek to strange new worlds as well.
Kevin: This feels like a question to
ask at the end of the season, but I'll
maybe plant it now in your mind, Rob,
is Is there too much fan service here?
Are we at the point where the young,
uh, new to Star Trek audience that this
show was ostensibly created for would
be feeling estranged or a little lost?
Rob: That's definitely something to work,
for us to explore more in detail after
we get through the rest of this season.
Um, and it's finding that balance of,
did, was, was season one enough of a,
uh, an introduction for them, and that
encouragement of going, Here are all
these characters, especially the episode
where there was the hologram of Odo and
Scotty and Spock to go, go and play.
You know, when it wasn't on, on Paramount
Plus that was pretty much an invitation
to the young Star Trek fans watching
going, you haven't seen any of this?
Go explore.
Go find.
Um, and so, yeah, I'll be, I'll
be interested to talk more about
it in detail once we've got
the whole picture of Season 2
Kevin: Ditto.
Yeah.
Alright, but let's talk
about broken captains.
Rob: Mmm.
Kevin: Well.
Season two of the original series
seems to have been a time where this
idea of, uh, a, a captain who's been
through tragedy being the heart of an
episode, because they did it twice.
They did it in episode six, The Doomsday
Machine, which we've talked about before.
And they did, they did it again
in episode 25, The Omega Glory,
which I don't think we've talked
Rob: We haven't.
Wonderful title!
Kevin: Mm.
I want to revisit Doomsday Machine,
because last time we talked about it,
it was about the ship being sacrificed,
and we, I talked a lot about the CG,
especially in the remastered version
of the episode, being worth a watch.
And all of that is still true.
But what I didn't maybe give enough
props to the last time we talked about
this, was the performance of Commodore
Matt Decker of the USS Constellation.
Um, and he's played by William Windom,
who strikes me as one of those Paramount
Day players who's probably played a
million sheriffs in westerns or whatever.
But yeah, he, uh, he took us on a
ride here with this broken captain.
So, if you haven't seen the episode, the
story is the Enterprise discovers the
Constellation adrift in space and like
one of its nacelles is half torn open
and it is basically a dead hulk in space.
And they beam aboard and find no
one aboard except when they go to
the auxiliary control room, they
find Commodore Matthew Decker
slumped over the console there.
And he is catatonic with
grief and shock at what has
befallen his ship and his crew.
We learn that the ship has been on the
run from this planet killer device,
which is the, the threat in this
episode, this big kind of cone shaped
snake with a fiery maw that, that
travels through space and eats planets.
When the ship was crippled,
Commodore Decker, to protect his
crew, to save his crew, beamed
them down to a planet for safety.
And then the transporter was knocked
out and the planet killer proceeded
to consume the planet where his entire
crew was taking refuge, and he was
left alone, last man on the ship, uh,
to watch this tragedy befall his crew.
When they are trying to get the story out
of him, Spock and Kirk, they're trying
to talk some sense into him, he does
these like silent screams where you,
he's just looking into space, reliving
it, and screaming without a voice.
And it is haunting.
Kirk shakes him and says,
Matt, where's your crew?
And he says, on the third planet.
There is no third planet.
Don't you think I know that?
There was, but not anymore.
They called me.
They begged me for help.
Four hundred of them.
I couldn't!
I couldn't!
It was amazing, especially for the time.
Just this little, like, guest
star part in an episode early
in Season 2 of this series.
It is I think, probably, the most
dramatic performance we get in Star Trek.
You know, maybe when in Amok Time, when
Spock realizes that he hasn't actually
killed his best friend Kirk, and calls
him Jim, maybe that is a little more
like emotionally affecting, but this is
probably the dramatic performance of the
series for me, Commodore Matt Decker.
Rob: OK, played by the
great William Windom.
I love a good, I love a good
research into, uh, stuff like that.
He's a heavy hitter.
He's a heavy hitter.
Sadly passed away in, uh, 2012,
but he got his cinema break.
His fir first big movie in, uh, on the
big screen was in To Kill a Mockingbird.
He played the prosecutor against,
Kevin: There you go.
Okay.
Not just a Paramount Day player then.
Rob: No.
Uh, he, but he did a lot of stuff.
He did the Donna Reed show,
Gunsmoke, um, he did four episodes
of Mission: Impossible, Ironside.
So, day player there, but his
big break was the prosecutor
in To Kill a Mockingbird.
He, um, Matt Decker reappeared
in Star Trek New Voyages.
I'm not sure
Kevin: Oh, that's a fan film.
Rob: fan film.
He came back for that.
Um, and, Yeah, he's just this, uh,
fabulous catalog of movies they did.
He's in Escape from the
Planet of the Apes, wonderful,
wonderful, one of fav franchises.
Trains, Planes and
Automobiles, Uncle Buck,
Kevin: what a career.
He's done a bit of everything.
Rob: huge, huge career.
So, I'm not surprised when you
say one of the greatest dramatic
performances of a, uh, supporting
actor in Star Trek, or of any actor.
He knew how to turn up, you know, take
his money, and he never phoned it in.
Kevin: Because we're here to talk about
how captains are affected by tragedy,
beyond this, like, first scene where we
meet this damaged captain, he goes on
to do some out of character things, and
often that kind of tragedy is what enables
characters to be pushed to places that
you wouldn't normally expect them to go.
Uh, I think we get a bit of that from
Chakotay as well in, uh, Prodigy.
Rob: Very much so.
Kevin: Decker here, he beams back
to the Enterprise to be treated for
his ordeal and Kirk stays behind
on the crippled Constellation.
Inevitably the planet killer comes
back, knocks out the transporters
so the captains have effectively
swapped ships, and Decker, who
outranks Kirk, assumes command of the
Enterprise and goes on a vendetta.
He decides he got it wrong the first
time, now he's got his second chance
at revenge, and he tries to take on
the planet killer, all the while Spock
trying to talk some sense into him.
And he does something that I've
seen, I can think of at least Captain
Stiles in Spacedock in Star Trek
III, when they steal the Enterprise.
You remember the captain
with the riding crop?
Yes.
He's the Excelsior captain.
We sometimes get these power mad,
uh, captains who have a quirk.
Stiles had his writing crop.
Decker here gets two of those colorful
recording tapes, and he, he fiddles with
them between his fingers, and he chews
on the corner of them in his mouth, as
he's plotting his maneuvers, and it's, it
makes you hate the guy despite the tragedy
he's been through because now he's about
to be responsible for the same tragedy
for the characters that we care about.
And, uh, Spock comes to the brink of
mutiny, leading a mutiny on the bridge
to regain control of the Enterprise.
It's really good.
There's lots of debates on the bridge
about regulations that apply when a
captain is mentally incapacitated and
attempted suicide would be a proof of
mental incapacitation, and I would relieve
you under those grounds, Commodore.
And yeah, really good stuff.
Rob: Excellent.
Kevin: I'll segue over to the Omega Glory,
which is another example of a captain
who has had tragedy befall his crew, who
seems a bit warped by the experience.
In this one, the Enterprise discovers
a Starfleet ship in orbit around an
uncharted planet, and there's nobody
aboard, so they go aboard, and there
are the remains of the crew aboard.
They've all been turned
into these white crystals.
They're all desiccated bodies.
So there's like, you know, uniforms
hanging over consoles with white
salt crystals hanging out of the,
uh, the cuffs of the, the uniforms.
So the entire crew has perished,
apparently due to a virus.
And the logs reveal that the landing
party contracted the virus on the
planet below, they beamed up, and the
entire crew contracted it and died.
Captain Tracey stayed below when the
landing party beamed up, and assumed
he would befall the same fate, but
by the time he realized he wasn't
getting sick, his entire crew was dead.
And he assumes that there is
some immunity on this planet.
And it has a very similar kind of plot
to Star Trek: Insurrection, where we
have the bad admiral there who thinks
they've found the Fountain of Youth.
Rob: In the Briar Patch.
Kevin: And Ronald Tracy basically decides,
oh, well, my crew is dead, but good
news is I've found the Fountain of Youth,
and that is how I'm gonna redeem myself.
That is pretty much, you know,
the good stuff of this episode.
The Omega Glory is commonly considered
one of the worst episodes of the original
series, unusual here in the second season.
Rob: Yeah, normally they're
all piled into season three.
Kevin: I'd say the first half
of it is fairly watchable.
There is some cringy, uh, racial
stereotyping, but they are, their
heart is in the right place.
So on this planet, there
are two, um, racial groups.
There are the Yangs and the
Coombs, and the Yangs are white
people who are like barbarians.
They can't be reasoned with.
They live in the hills.
They have no culture.
Um, and the Coombs are kind of Asiatics,
they are called in the episode.
They, they look Asian
to outward appearances.
They seem cultured.
They live in, um, they live in, in
cities, but they are primitive cities.
And we learned there was an atomic
holocaust on this planet that basically
destroyed the culture of the Yangs,
nearly destroyed the culture of the
Coombs, and now these two races,
uh, don't communicate anymore.
And Ronald Tracey, Captain Tracey
goes, well, If we're going to
bring this technology to, uh, the
Federation and perhaps sell it to
the highest bidder, we need to defend
these gates from the barbarians.
And so he uses his personal phaser to, to,
uh, to kill off about a thousand of these
barbarians that are attacking the city in
flagrant violation of the Prime Directive.
Rob: Ah, yeah!
Kevin: And this is what Kirk and Spock
and Bones discover when they beam down and
their ill fated red shirt who takes one
for the team pretty early in the episode.
Rob: Respect to the redshirt.
Kevin: So yeah, Kirk discovers that
Tracey has violated the Prime Directive
and is continuing to do so, takes
the Enterprise landing party hostage.
Uh, Bones figures out that the infection
is actually cured after a couple of
days on the planet's surface, and it's
safe to beam back now, and if only
the crew of the, uh, the Exeter had
beamed down for a couple of days, they
would have all been fine, but, uh,
that, so much, so much the tragedy.
Rob: That's a tragedy as well.
Yeah.
Of course, Captain Tracey played by
Morgan Woodward, who was player and had
some time in the TV show Gunsmoke, was
in the Life and Legend of Wyatt Earp.
These two biggest roles were, uh, as Boss
Godfrey in Cool Hand Luke, incredible
1967 film with Paul Newman and George
Kennedy, and also in the 80s, uh, 70s and
80s had a role in Dallas as Punk Anderson.
So there you go.
Kevin: He also was previously in a guest
starring role in the original series.
He appeared in, uh, season one's Dagger
of the Mind and was Simon Van Gelder,
who I think may have been the recipient
of the first on screen Vulcan mind meld
with, uh, Spock in sickbay, while he
relived the horror that he had, uh,
he had experienced in that episode.
But, uh, ultimately he is, he is
irretrievably corrupted before we even
meet him in this episode, and this episode
is more a process of discovering just how
bad he's made it for himself, and, uh,
Kirk in the end needs to take him down.
Uh, this episode goes off the rails
in the third act, where they discover
the Yangs and the Coombs are twisted
versions of the Yanks and the
Communists, and that this entire planet
was a parallel evolution of Earth,
so much so that they had these same,
… Rob: terminology?
Kevin: yeah, the same names for
the, uh, the Communists and the,
the Yanks, warring and with each
other, and that nuclear World War
III is what decimated the planet.
And they discover that the Yangs,
what they worship is the United
States Constitution, word for word.
They speak a twisted version of it
that Kirk recognizes and recites from
memory with old glory, the United
States flag, which, is present on
this planet as an object of worship.
The score of this episode mixes the
fanfare of, of Star Trek with The
Star Spangled Banner at the end, and
it is as cringy as one might imagine.
Rob: Yay?
Kevin: Yeah, but yeah, good stuff,
good fisticuffs, lots of wrestling and
fighting with the two captains there.
It does ultimately come
down to a wrestling match.
That is how they decide to
settle their differences.
And it's, uh, yeah, good fun, but very
much 60s popcorn fare at that point.
Rob: We wouldn't expect any less for
those old scientist episode of Star Trek.
Kevin: So I'm, I guess the summing
up here, the original series used
captains who've, who have had
tragedies befall them as, an excuse
for having them behave as villains
effectively, even if only temporarily.
Rob: Exactly.
Yes, that's a, that's a good
way to look at those, uh,
those examples that you gave.
I'll follow on in that connection, it's
a small part, but it's a very tragic
part, uh, looking at Star Trek II, The
Wrath of Khan, and we're looking at the
captain of the Reliant, uh, that is,
of course, Clark Terrell, the captain,
played by the brilliant, Paul Winfield.
Kevin: Ah, yes.
Rob: So, Captain of the Reliant heads
to Ceti Alpha V, and they come across
of course Khan and his followers.
He's taken over by the mind worm.
Kevin: All I can remember of this
character is him turning his phaser
on himself to relieve himself of the
screaming mind worm in his skull.
It's pretty memorable.
Rob: He gets, he has the worst day ever.
He starts
Kevin: Is the worst day!
Yeah, it all goes wrong very
Rob: He, yeah, everything
goes pear shaped.
He gets, he gets kidnapped, he
gets tortured, you know, he has no
control over his, uh, own faculties.
He has to witness the
massacre of the scientists.
He then tries to fight his
way out of being controlled
and then takes his own life.
It's not a good day for Captain Terrell.
It's, it's, it's, it's horrifying stuff.
It's tragic stuff from a point of
view of just a supporting, a glorified
red shirt, but so much tragedy
added to it and, uh, being forced
to be the assistant of the villain.
Kevin: A heroic end, I suppose,
the, uh, the ripping off the
communicator from his wrist.
I feel like that is the one time those
wrist communicators that, that came
in in Star Trek, The Motion Picture.
It's the one time they, they did something
interesting on screen is when Terrell
had to rip it off with his teeth.
Um, pretty cinematic.
Uh, it wouldn't have been quite the same
if he'd just like thrown his communicator
on the ground and stomped on it.
Rob: Nicholas Meyer, man, he knew
how to, you know, to amp up that
tension and bring you theatricality.
Um, and yeah, the ultimate sacrifice,
he, you know, to, to kill himself so
he no longer had to feel that pain
or be under the control of Khan.
Kevin: It's hard to know how much to
attribute to the, the eel in his head and
how much to attribute to the tragedy, but
he does have that, that catatonic broken
man look about him when they discover him.
And, and he talks about what happens
and how Khan was wild and screaming.
And yeah, there, there are those,
there is that scene of seeing that
broken captain that is quite affecting.
Rob: Yeah, Paul Winfield
was a great actor.
He also appeared in, um, the
original Terminator as one of the
cannon fodder cops at the start.
Um, he also did a show that I loved
as a kid that didn't last very long
called The Charmings, which is pretty
much like all the characters from, uh,
fairy tales go into the modern world.
And he played the magic mirror
that the, uh, stepmother, who's
the wicked witch, talks to.
He was very funny in it.
And he also won an Emmy for
Picket Fences, a David E.
Kelly show that I really loved
in the 90s, that kind of, as, you
know, Don Cheadle was in it, and,
um, it was a great TV series, but,
um, not many people remember it.
But yes,
Kevin: I will always remember
him as the captain from the one
of my favorite episodes of Star
Trek, The Next Generation, Darmok.
So he did come back to Star Trek
in The Next Generation, yeah,
Darmok and Jalad at Tanagra.
That was him, that captain.
Rob: There you go.
So I wanted to move on and talk briefly
about two captains that are familiar
within, and are lead characters within
the Star Trek franchise, one that is
pretty much based in tragedy, and we
are now in the process of seeing that
being played out, and so much so, people
wondering whether they're gonna take that
tragedy away and give him a happy ending.
So there's, uh, Pike, looking at, you
know, our dear Pike in Strange New Worlds.
Um, we've talked many episodes about him
and his, you know, original appearance
and they couldn't get the actor back
for when they just put him in, put
him in a self contained wheelchair
slash, uh, iron lung, and the brave
choice of bringing him into Discovery.
The only way that he could help in the
mission is to find out his own destiny.
And so, are they going to change canon?
They can't, they can't, they can't
have him end up the way that he ends up
because he's just too good a character
and we got to know him so well.
Kevin: I, yeah, I don't know.
I I'm not sure I'll go along with it
if they do change his fate because
Rob: They can't.
Kevin: They can't.
Yeah, exactly.
Yeah, the tragic, the tragic destination
is so much of this character.
I don't think they could,
they could back out of that.
It's interesting to me how
they changed it to make it more
tragic for Strange New Worlds.
In the original series, when we met
him, it was really that he had, I think
they mentioned that he had like saved a
crew of cadets or something like that.
But the tragedy was really that,
that, that amazing captain, that
amazing leader was now, uh, an invalid
physically for the rest of his life.
That was one kind of tragedy, but in,
in Strange New Worlds, they introduce
us to the kids who will die on that deck
when Pike survives and is mutilated.
And that, the deaths of those
kids is now the tragedy that,
he is faced with, it feels like.
Rob: Yeah, it's definitely added
in that other component and shaped
it into more than just that rather
limited 60s justification to get to
the point of, well, we can't have the
original actor back and, um, we've
got to make him hideously beyond
repair and we'll do all this type
of stuff and he saves some people.
Um, but you can actually explore what
that means on an emotional level.
Kevin: It's interesting,
it's like a pre tragedy.
Like, that is a very
science fiction thing.
It's someone who is yet to experience a
tragedy, has foreknowledge of a tragedy.
Rob: And, you know, what his legacy will
be and what he wants his legacy to be
and what he gets within the ticking clock
that he has in life now, what that means.
Kevin: No less affecting.
In some ways, is affected just
as some of these other captains
we're seeing, that, uh, that it
changes the decisions they make.
Their judgment is affected by that, that
event, even though it's in his future.
Rob: Exactly.
And the one thing that we've brought
back many times before, the whole
point of the original return episode
of him, he knows what he wants to do.
He wants to go back to where it
all started because that's where
he can be in the form that he wants
to be and live out his life on that
planet, uh, in his original form.
They can't have forgotten, right?
They know, they're pushing the
tragedy a lot, and maybe those
people who are believing the
tragedy, haven't seen those episodes.
But he, he, gets what he, what
we can consider a happy ending
for, you know, his containment.
So, are they keeping
that back for a reason?
But I'm also got that
maybe they've forgotten.
Kevin: no, we know that,
but Pike can't know that yet
Rob: No, he can't, no.
Because that takes away, that
takes away the importance
Kevin: heroism.
Yeah.
Yeah.
it's like when a character sacrifices
themselves, but then are saved through
some trick of science fiction, and
it's like, whew, I'm still a hero
because I sacrificed myself assuming
I would die, but I'm here to come
back in the next episode next week.
It's one of those.
Rob: Exactly.
It very much is so one of those,
one of those, um, wave your hands
away of the justification of it.
And finally, it's that case, we have
talked about it before, but it's the, the
longer you play a character on television
especially, the writers are inspired by
the actor's unique personalities, their
backstory, their history, and all that
type of stuff, and how the character
blends into the actor the longer you play.
Case in point in Modern Family,
the character of Cameron, the
actor who played him trained to
be a clown, so they incorporated
that element into the character.
On other shows they've incorporated
elements like in Brooklyn Nine Nine,
they've incorporated elements of the
actors' backstory in their own life,
and with, Picard, with Jean Luc Picard,
elements of Patrick Stewart's, the
issues he had in his own past has
been incorporated to dramatic effect
to influence Picard's dark backstory
that we never really knew about.
The only huge tragedy we kinda
knew about was the loss of his
brother's family in Generations.
Um, so, but in Picard season two, we
find out this whole deeply dark backstory
that doesn't really go with the Star Trek
world of where they were with medicine and
mental health and all that type of stuff.
You know, you look at Picard, the longer
you play a character, the more losses
you face, and you look at him at the
end, it goes, and he ends quite, um,
optimistically in Season 3, but in Season
2, there is that element of, you know,
at the end of Season 1 of Picard, he
dies, and he comes back as an android.
Season 2, the android version of him has
to go through this emotional trauma of
remembering the tragedy of, you know,
domestic violence and abuse at home.
Kevin: Yeah, it's a, it's a different
kind of tragedy than, like, it's not in
the line of duty, but it is definitely
there in the character, for sure.
Rob: And so, and that's where a point
of adding in those tragic elements.
Does it muddy the water?
Does it, does it shift the
established lore of a character?
And, or does it enhance them in some way?
That's very, interesting choice
that was made, and the backlash
from it was quite a, um, an
interesting thing to witness as well.
Kevin: It's not like
Picard Needed more tragedy.
I guess they went, you know what,
you know when Picard is really
good, is when bad stuff happens.
What other can we make happen to him?
Yeah, strange one.
The exploration of a family tragedy rather
than a tragedy in the line of duty and
as a Starfleet captain, I suppose, maybe
appealed to the storytellers, including
Patrick Stewart himself, who, um, the
story goes was motivated to return to
this show by taking the character to
places that we had not seen him go before.
So I suppose that might've
been the draw here.
If you really wanted to squint and
look for it, I think you could maybe
tell yourself that Picard being
forced to acknowledge and reckon
with those childhood traumas and
experiences and remember them again
and take them back into his being
maybe softened him a bit into the
man we see in season three the show.
I don't think it was
necessary for the character.
I think everything we saw in season
three from Picard could have been
done without that additional element.
Rob: And it is very much case of
it wasn't really brought up again.
And so us, us as fans, as we are wont
to do going, how can we justify this,
um, to make it work and fit in with the
whole picture of an arc, a character
arc that hasn't really been filled
in because season one, two, and three
are so disjointed in its storytelling.
Kevin: I had a couple of others that
I left on the table that I'll just
briefly mention completeness sake.
In The Next Generation Season
4, Episode 12, The Wounded.
This is a good O'Brien episode.
O'Brien gets to meet an old captain
of his, Benjamin Maxwell, who is
now in command of the USS Phoenix.
Benjamin Maxwell lost his entire family
to a Cardassian, uh, war invasion that
he was too late to save them from.
And now he is in command of a, a
new ship that is required to assist
with enforcing the peace under the
new treaty with the Cardassians.
And so he is a captain who is affected
by that tragedy in his background.
He does not trust the Cardassians.
He goes rogue to attempt to prove
that they are still smuggling
weapons under a flag of truce.
And, uh, O'Brien has to talk him down.
And if you're thinking I
wonder if he was right?
That is a very good question.
You watch the episode to find out.
Rob: Ha ha.
Kevin: Uh, and then in, uh, Voyager,
there's the season five finale and
season six premiere, Equinox, part one
and two, where we get to meet Captain
Rudolph "Rudy" Ransom of the Equinox,
uh, a much smaller ship that, you
remember a few weeks back, or a few
episodes back, when we were talking
about Caretaker, the, the premiere of
Voyager, and I remarked on this one line
that said, a bunch of ships, they've
been bringing ships here for months.
And I was like, why didn't we
ever meet any of those ships?
Well, it turns out we did.
We met the Equinox.
The Equinox was another Starfleet
ship that got brought into the Delta
Quadrant just like Voyager and was
also trying to find their way home.
But they were a smaller ship
that had a rougher ride.
They lost half their crew in their
first encounter with an alien species
in the Delta Quadrant and the captain,
um, took it pretty hard and started
making some extreme decisions.
They ended up, torturing and killing,
some life forms from another dimension
in order to get power to boost the speed
of their warp engines and, and shave some
of their time off of their trip home.
And when Voyager, it takes a little while
for the truth to come out of exactly
what's gone on, on board this ship.
And, uh, Rudy Ransom and his crew.
inevitably become the antagonists in this
two parter, where Voyager has to, uh,
attempt to bring them to justice without
getting themselves killed in the process.
Rob: I do remember that one.
It's an incredibly powerful episode, the
two parter, where everyone goes, well,
why are they, for, up until that point,
everyone had been going, why are they
just sticking to the Prime Directive?
Why are they doing all this type of stuff?
And then you see in Equinox what happens
when Federation members, uh, push to
the point where they just, let go of
everything that they believe to survive.
And it's, um, it's, it's
ugly, and it's, yeah, as you
said, they had a rougher ride.
They're a smaller ship, so they
didn't have as much protection
or, um, firepower as Voyager.
Kevin: There's a delicious little scene
on the bridge where, uh, where Rudy
goes, Hey, so, Janeway, uh, no particular
reason, but, uh, I was wondering, did you
ever have to break the Prime Directive?
Janeway goes, Oh yeah, we came
close, bent the rules now and then,
but never completely broke it.
Why?
How about you?
And he goes, Oh, no reason.
Yeah, me neither.
Rob: At the, at the end of this episode,
I think some of the crew that survive the
Equinox actually come on board Voyager as
Kevin: Three of them, yeah.
Janeway gives them a dressing
down and names them by first and
last name very conspicuously.
And it's you are now part of this ship,
Brendan Fraser or whatever their were.
And, uh, and you're like, Ooh, I will
remember those names because obviously
they're going to be return characters.
None of them ever returned
on screen, unfortunately.
Rob: Again, another letdown of not really
embracing the arc of what it could be.
But it's a powerful two part story
and I really like that, that moment
of what could have been, Voyager
could have gone down a darker path.
Kevin: At least two of those three
characters were memorable enough that when
they said their names I was like, whoo,
I look forward to seeing these come back.
One of them is an ensign who was like,
racked by guilt, but felt like her job
as a Starfleet officer was to follow
the orders of her and when her captain
gets relieved, she's like, Oh, I'm so
glad you, you know, made it so I could
stop following those terrible orders.
And then the captain resumes his post.
It's just like, Oh, I guess I got
to go back following these orders.
And it's just really, um, yeah,
you know, rich stuff watching
those, uh, those torn characters.
Um, yeah, a shame they didn't come back.
You know, what stands out to me
is that we never saw a tragically
affected captain, quite the same
as Chakotay here in Prodigy.
A captain who is affected by
tragedy and basically like, gives
up, and becomes a hermit on a ship.
I mean, Raffi Musiker in Picard
season one has a similar kind of arc
that she, you know, turns to drugs
in the bottle and goes out and lives
at Vasquez Rocks in a, a combi van,
but, um, but she was never a captain.
I am happy to discover that, that with
Chakotay, we are seeing a story that
we've not seen in Star Trek before.
And, uh, that's very refreshing
every time it happens.
Rob: Definitely, yeah.
And we, cause we had like a brief
encounter with his number one and
to be told about Chakotay, sort of
like the loss of his number one's
life just simply because Chakotay had
given up and didn't it was possible.
And that guilt racked with him
going, I didn't believe him and I
didn't believe that we could get out.
So that arc of him, redemption arc,
was a, a beautiful thing to see.
Kevin: All right, well there you go.
We got one last block of five episodes
and then we'll be on hiatus until
the final season of Lower Decks.
So, uh, I hope Star Trek makes these last
five episodes a good one, because it's
the last new Star Trek for a little while.
Rob: It is, it is, and hopefully it's not
the, uh, last, uh, what we see of Prodigy.
Kevin: No, well, it won't be
because the show ran out of steam.
This is as good as Prodigy
has ever been, I feel like.
And if it goes out, uh, this way,
it'll go out on a high note at least.
Rob: Most definitely.
It's been very consistent.
Two seasons of very consistent Star
Trek, which is a odd thing to have,
and, uh, embrace it while we have it.
